Republican to Ukraine: You can flip MAGA

With the election race in the US gathering pace, and Donald Trump’s return to the White House looking increasingly likelier, Euromaidan Press talked with Steven Moore, a well-known Capitol Hill figure, ex-chief of staff at the US House of Representatives, and founder of the Ukraine Freedom Project that helps American policymakers get firsthand information about Ukraine.

A well-connected Republican, he’s one of the key advocates who helped Ukraine secure US aid in April 2024.

He knows who’s pulling the strings in the Republican and Democrat Party, running the show in the US, how Americans respond to freedom and why America First has an Afghanistan and Iraq hangover.

As well as how to win over MAGA and former US President Donald Trump’s heart “because when Trump gets in front of a camera or a social media platform, he has to perform.”

You can also watch the interview on YouTube.

You know Ukraine is going to win. Faster if they get more weapons

Euromaidan Press (EP): Steven, thank you for agreeing to this interview. Tell us a little bit about yourself. You’re in Ukraine right now?

Steven Moore: Yes, in Kyiv since the fifth day of the full-scale war. I wanted to help my friends who were all in hot spots like Kyiv and Kharkiv. They were calling and saying that Kyiv was bombed. I had spent nearly two years in Iraq as a civilian at the beginning of that war, so I knew what to do. I hopped on a plane, flew into Bucharest, drove to Chernivtsi, and started trying to help people get out.

EP: What’s your take on the current situation?

Steven: I just got back from Kharkiv, Izium, and Kherson in the last couple of weeks and, I think, the Americans need to get weapons to the front more quickly.

I am always amazed at the bravery and ingenuity of the Ukrainian warfighters. For six months, they did not have sufficient ammunition.

In lieu of 155-millimeter shells, Ukrainians have started churning out FPV drones for 500 bucks apiece. They deliver a kilogram payload, which is enough to kill a lot of Russians and disable armored vehicles.

It’s really fascinating and interesting. You know Ukraine is going to win. Faster if they got more weapons.

EP: One of our readers actually asked which type of weaponry is necessary the most at the moment. Like F-16s, air defense? What’s the most critical?

Steven: I think the 155-millimeter shells. They’re like the bread and butter of warfare at this point.

You just need a lot of shells as well as electronic jamming equipment so they can jam the Russian drones. I hear that’s very important. Everybody wants F-16s but they’re not the panacea to all Ukraine’s problems at the front.

Everything is kind of needed. Even AK-47 rounds because apparently most of them are made in Russia that’s not exporting them to Ukraine. One of the biggest plants in the Soviet Union was in Luhansk, now occupied by the Russians.

So more of everything, but it would require more aid.

EP: That’s what I wanted to ask you since you are one of the persons who advocated Ukraine aid. You’re a Republican, right?

Steven: I am indeed a Republican

EP: Who actually supports Ukraine….

Steven: There’s a lot of us, yeah.

EP: That’s great to hear. Because there’s a “party” within your party, Make America Great Again (MAGA), that doesn’t really support Ukraine. So, you were promoting the aid that was eventually approved in April. Could you offer us a glimpse of what it looked like behind the scenes? Because from what I read and heard, US House of Representatives Speaker Mike Johnson was, for example, convinced not least due to the religious factor.

Steven: I was the chief of staff in the US House of Representatives. When I came to Ukraine, I started doing humanitarian work that was necessary at the time.

At some point, I realized that I am one of the few people in the world who has been to the Ukrainian front and the floor of the US House of Representatives.

So, I started recognizing that my friends back on Capitol Hill were not getting the information they needed. Certainly, not accurate information or all of it.

In December 2022, two things happened. One, Tucker Carlson started saying that President Volodymyr Zelenskyy was persecuting Christians which is utter nonsense. I live here. It’s not happening.

And I met Viktor Cherniavskyi. He was sharing a co-working space with me and in December 2022, he just came to me and said: “Hi! I’m Viktor. I’m an Evangelical Christian.”

My experience with evangelical Christians in Ukraine is that they’re really that. Even the most devout people in the US are not as forward about their faith as to use it in the first 30 seconds of a conversation.

Viktor went on to tell me that he was a pastor in Russian-occupied Luhansk. And he was getting families out of it in 2014. One day when he had a group that included a pregnant woman and a newborn. The Russians pulled him over, took him out of his car, and straight to the basement. I know that you know, what this means. But some of your readers may not.

It’s a euphemism for being tortured.

Viktor was tortured for 25 days, including one day when the Russians were torturing him with an electrical taser, the kind you might use for self-defense. And there was a Russian Orthodox priest, standing over him to cast demons out of him for being an evangelical Christian. Yes, I see the look in your eyes.

EP: Well, I’ve heard a lot of stories but this is something…

Steven: That’s what I said. You know, I have been to the front around 15 times and I’ve seen a lot and I’ve heard a lot. But every time that I think I’ve heard the most horrible things the Russians can do, I hear more.

My mind was blown by what Viktor told me, and so I thought that Christians in America need to know this. We got Viktor in some stories in early 2023.

But it was when I recognized that the Republicans were going to have a real obstructionary role in getting the next aid bill passed that I got very serious.

We mounted a campaign – and I’ve run campaigns all my life together with a man named Karl Ahlgren who spent over 20 years on Capitol Hill.

Anna Shvetsova is the third member of our team. She’s the Ukrainian who knows the most people working in Congress and because she, Karl, and I went to a hundred congressional offices to tell Viktor’s story and the story of people like him, it helped.

We did a survey last September and found that about 60% of Republicans identify as evangelical Christians. So Russia is torturing and murdering Ukrainians who worship God like they do and share their faith. Once they were presented with this information, they were much more likely to support aid to Ukraine. So, we just started running a campaign and, in October, we got our first op-ed published – even though nobody wanted it.

A Christian foreign policy magazine called Providence Magazine published a piece on this. We worked and worked and, in December, we put up https://russiatortureschristians.org with the testimonies of Christians and pastors who had escaped the occupied areas of Ukraine and survived Russian torture. Like Melitopol, Mariupol, and other places.

We did a digital campaign in Speaker Johnson’s district and a bunch of others.

We went from nobody caring about this to being featured in Time Magazine, USA Today, Newsweek twice, and Fox Radio one week before the vote.

So, the CIA’s intelligence briefings gave Speaker Johnson the intellectual information that he needed to understand why Ukraine is important to America’s interest. Meanwhile, the Ukraine Freedom Project and our allies were able to give Johnson the emotional and spiritual connection to Ukraine. This is the role that faith played in getting Republicans to vote for Ukraine aid.

Trump could have blown up the Ukraine aid bill at any time – but he didn’t

EP: What about Trump? Speaker Johnson talked to him right before the aid was eventually approved. This leads me basically to two questions. First, Trump is a big figure in the Republican party. That’s obvious. But is he the only one who’s pulling the strings? Or who is the most important guy right now in the Republican Party, except for Trump?

Steven: Well, Speaker Johnson, certainly.

If Trump was not the presidential nominee, Speaker Johnson would be de facto the most powerful Republican in America.

Mind you, Trump didn’t tweet something negative about the Ukraine aid bill. He could have blown this up at any time with a tweet or with a statement even though he’s not on Twitter (now X, EP).

Aside from that, I can tell you that as a moderator on a panel at the Odesa Black Sea Security Forum, there were a lot of people from the Heritage Foundation [a conservative think tank based in Washington, D.C. – EP] and the America First circle.

I haven’t spent much time with these folks and I have not had a high opinion of their views of Ukraine. But when I engaged with them for a couple of hours just by being there, they were gaining new information about Ukraine as a partner and about Ukrainians’ ability to win, and Ukraine as a whole.

I’ve seen so many coincidences in this business since I’ve been in Ukraine. One of the guys didn’t have anything to do on a Sunday so I said let me take you to Kherson. My colleague arranged a quick last-minute tour of Kherson city. We got within three kilometers of the Russians and his mind was blown.

“So, here’s the common thread. Speaker Johnson saw the intelligence and understood the strategic importance of supporting Ukraine even though he had voted against Ukraine nine out of nine times. Likewise, the folks from the Heritage Foundation saw with their own eyes what’s going on here and became more favorable to Ukraine.

People who we’re familiar with from the right and mostly anti-Ukraine are not dogmatic or incapable of changing their minds. It’s incumbent upon us and the intelligence community and others who know what’s going on here in Ukraine to give them the information they need to make good decisions.”

EP: Perhaps, this means that Ukraine’s current strategic communication isn’t really good? Not hitting the points that are important for the MAGA crowd? Or people generally who are not that interested in Ukraine?

Because I also have an experience with a MAGA person who’s into the America First concept. He wants less Washington DC and more power at the state level. I get that but he didn’t say that you know “I hate Ukraine.” On the contrary, we had a good conversation. He still thinks that Europe should be doing more than the US

Steven: I think that too

EP: This is actually where I concurred with him. All these attempts to say that the EU is doing a lot… Of course. But, you know, for years many of those member states were not really contributing enough to NATO’s defense. Not even two percent of the GDP. Germany, I think, was not performing particularly well. I get that.

Texty.org.ua that accused 112 members of Congress of being Russian agents did terrible journalism

EP: So, what is it that Ukraine must focus on in its strategic communication at the moment to reach the MAGA crowd? It looks like Trump is going to return to the White House following the recent debate. Especially if Biden isn’t replaced. I think it’s almost a guarantee.

Steven: Even if Biden is replaced, the Democrats are going to be fractured. They’re going to have to introduce someone new to America in 90 or 120 days, or whatever it is.

The Democrats were foolish in trying to deceive the world that Joe Biden is competent enough right now to lead America. The guy’s been out of it for a year, maybe, years. There’s a great video going around of the 2019 debates where Biden’s on top of it and just knocking it out and the recent debates where he could not put together a coherent sentence.

So, the Democrats were not only foolish but dangerous in doing this. It’s really disappointing to see that.

Regarding Ukraine: there’s the official Ukrainian response and then there are the Ukrainian advocates.

Take this group called Texty.org.ua.

It accused 112 members of Congress of being Russian agents without proof. This makes it very difficult to flip these people from no to yes. Before it’d have been easier because many people voted against Ukraine since their district, the people who elected them, was against Ukraine. There are many people I know who helped behind the scenes but could not vote for Ukraine in the final bill as they felt it would have impacted their ability to get re-elected.

It is after all the House of Representatives, meaning you represent the will of your voters. It is rational and the way democracy works.

Now, this group did terrible journalism. I looked through all their stuff and they’re incapable of researching Congress in a confident way at this point. They’re just not good at it. It comes off as a hit piece against Republicans who maintain Republican support for Ukraine and point out Russian propaganda which we do all the time with very data-driven and fact-based information.

It’s not helpful for people doing the work that I’m doing. And they’re raising money off of it now. It’s really damaging to Ukraine’s efforts.

Instead, here are the America First myths you can actually push back on. One of them is that they believe that Putin will never go into a NATO country – which the nine NATO countries bordering Ukraine and Russia would disagree with.

Or other myths that Ukraine can’t beat Russia and or that Russia does not have the means to go into Latvia or Poland.

I think what needs to happen is that nine NATO countries bordering Ukraine have to hold hands and start shouting about Putin’s “going to get us next.” I know they do this but they need to do it over and over again. They need to get in with the American first people and explain it to them.

Trump can be charming. Ukraine needs to talk to him

EP: We touched upon Trump already, and I wanted to ask you if you ever encountered him in real life.

Steven: Not in a significant fashion. When you work on Capitol Hill, you bounce off all kinds of people. Like who’s it today? Prime Minister of England?

I did not work on Capitol Hill when Trump was President. So, I don’t recall meeting him.

EP: The reason why I’m asking is that he appears to be a pretty whimsical person, very kind of self-focused, if not a megalomaniac. I wanted to know whether he’s so in real life or is it his public persona? Besides, he says a lot of contentious things. Like during a rally when he said that Russia can attack the NATO member states that don’t pay up.

Is that what he really thinks? Or is he flexible? Ukraine at the moment has to win over his heart, and we need approaches to him. He has a history with Ukraine that is not so great due to the Hunter Biden affair.

If he comes back, we’ll have to have a new kind of communication and understand how to convince him that it’s worth supporting Ukraine. Or does he know that and is kind of flirting with the MAGA crowd and people who are concerned about immigration and inflation?

Steven: I’ll give you an example involving the International Brotherhood of Teamsters.

They’re the major labor union in the US. One of the biggest and most historic. In fact, a teamster is someone back a hundred years ago or more that would drive teams of horses with things like beer or whale oil.

They have millions of people working for them.

For years, they endorsed the Democrats and then they felt like the Democrats weren’t prioritizing their interests anymore.

One of my best friends is a senior executive in the Teamsters so they went and met with Trump at Mar-a-Lago. He said they had a two-hour dinner with him and Trump was charming and interested in everyone else.

It’s not like my friend is a billionaire or senator or something like that. But Trump took a real interest in him and on a personal level Trump is very charming.

He may get their endorsement.

So, I would say that senior people in the Ukrainian government just need to meet with Trump and kind of do it on a behind-the-scenes basis. Because when Trump gets in front of a camera or a social media platform, he has to perform.

What we’re doing is that we’re reaching out to the people who are going to be around Trump, and we’re giving them the information they might need to make better decisions. They’re not getting that information because there is a lot of Russian propaganda in the US.

When they come to Ukraine, they understand. When I am able to give them persuasive information for them not being here you know it’s helpful, but you know, we got to get more people over here that are going to be around Trump so it’s a matter of creating those personal connections with Ukraine, giving them the understanding what’s going on here because Ukraine is a story of freedom and Americans respond to freedom.

Ukraine is a country that’s been trying to throw off the Russians for decades or centuries. They’re doing a really good job of it right now.

Also, Americans like a winner, and displaying the degree to which Ukraine is winning is also important.

The Russians have been trying to take over Ukraine for 10 years and they have 17% of their country to show for it. The Russians have lost half a million people or 17%. That’s the message that needs to get out.

Russia won’t use nukes, here’s what keeps me sleeping at night

EP: I have two final questions based on what you previously talked about. Let’s say that Biden does get re-elected. Obviously, the man is not really fit at the moment. And it seems like somebody else may be making the decisions for him. Who’s pulling the strings in the Democrat Party?

Steven: Like who’s running our country?

EP: Yes. Jake Sullivan or somebody else?

Steven: Jake Sullivan is running the show here in Ukraine. And Jake Sullivan is a lawyer. To the best of my knowledge, they don’t offer classes on military strategy in law schools. Lawyers mitigate risk. So that’s the way that Sullivan is approaching this war.

You know, I have no problem with what Biden or Sullivan or whoever was running the show in 2022. It was great in 2022. They got a lot of weapons here. The Ukrainians took back a lot of territory.

Then Jake started slow-walking weapons to Ukraine.

In January 2023, they promised 31 Abrams tanks. They got to Ukraine in October, so 10 months later.

What is the job of the US Department of Defense if not to get weapons to a war zone quickly? You could have driven the tanks to Ukraine in 10 months. Likewise, in February F-16s were a bad idea, in May they’re a good idea – and they’re still not here.

So, you give the Russians a lot of time to build formidable defenses of dragon’s teeth and minefields that go on for kilometers.

We’re in a situation where you need to find someone to run Biden’s foreign policy and foreign military departments who is not as afraid of the Russians as Jake Sullivan.

EP: What does he fear the most? Nukes?

Steven: Yeah, so Putin says I’m going to use nukes and, you know, Jake Sullivan goes home and cries.

I live in Kyiv. I’m at the top of the nuclear target list or somewhere near the top, and here’s what keeps me sleeping at night.

One, China has been very clear with Putin several times in public that we don’t want nuclear weapons used in Ukraine and, you know, China is the godfather of all this. Russia is essentially a client state of China. So if they’re to use nuclear weapons, you can make the argument that they can afford to alienate the West, but not China.

So, using tactical nuclear weapons gets Russia very little and costs them quite a lot.

This is a classic case of trying to micromanage a war. It’s what happened in Vietnam. You don’t try to win but micromanage the war for strategic objectives that are ultimately meaningless and counterproductive. That’s apparently what Jake Sullivan is trying to do.

EP: One final question. Not so long ago, I think it was either Reuters or AP that broke the news that two advisers had presented a peace plan to Trump, according to which Ukraine will get the weapons, while Moscow will be threatened with an escalation unless it takes it seriously. What do you make of it? It seems like Trump liked it.

Steven: Well, I don’t think Trump’s single one way or the other. What we hear about the meeting came from the people that presented the plan. Trump’s campaign hasn’t said anything official.

I will point out that, in 2014, Poroshenko went to Congress and said, “please send me weapons, the Russians invaded my country.” Back then, Obama was in charge and Jake Sullivan was a prominent member of his National Security apparatus.

They sent blankets instead.

Then in 2017, they sent Javelin missiles which were helpful and Ukraine was able to hold off the Russians when they came into the country.

So there’s kind of what Trump says and what Trump does. All hope is not lost if Trump becomes president. In terms of this peace plan, I have to note that particularly America First has an Afghanistan and Iraq hangover.

So they think if they pull out, there’ll be no meaningful consequences because this country is very far away.

But that’s not the case. What America hasn’t adjusted its thinking to is that we are in a global war right now. There’s a shooting war in Europe and in the Middle East. The Chinese have said that in 2027, they’re going to invade Taiwan. My friends in the DOD say that they’re adjusting to that and thinking it’s going to move more closely.

Russia is also causing trouble in Africa. So you know we are in a global war and the only people acting on that information are our adversaries.

If Putin says tomorrow alright let’s have a peace treaty and he’s already in violation of dozens of peace treaties and ceasefires all sorts of things, including treaties with the US why would Putin keep his word in this particular peace treaty?

Second, we’re giving him an opportunity to re-arm.

Third, if China goes into Taiwan or another shooting war erupts somewhere else in the world, Putin’s going to say, all right, everyone’s distracted. I’m going in.

So you know, I’d like to repeat what’s been previously said. This is a great deal for the American taxpayer: for the price equal to 3% more or less of the annual spending, the US Department of Defense, we have taken a big chunk out of forces belonging to our major adversary.

Half a million Russian soldiers have been taken out, thousands of tanks, and not one American in active duty has lost their lives in Ukraine.